106：为什么停止做凯格尔斯& Squat Instead with 凯蒂 Bowman

孩子：欢迎来到我的妈妈’s podcast.

凯蒂：您好，欢迎来到“起点生活播客。” I’来自wellnessmama.com的m Katie。和我’m here today with, I think, the most requested podcast guest ever. 凯蒂 Bowman is a biomechanist by training 和 a problem-solver at heart. She has an award-winning blog 和 podcast called “Katy Says,”她每个月都会接触数十万人。很多人参加了她的现场课程，在线课程，并且她’是八本书的作者。这些都将在显示注释中。我推荐其中的每一个，但包括 “Move 您r DNA” 和 “Movement Matters.” And I’ve used her information personally when I had breech babies, when I had sciatica during pregnancy. She has a ton of amazing information. I would highly encourage you to check her out. But 我可以’t wait to jump in right now. So, 凯蒂, welcome 和 thanks for being here.

凯蒂: Thanks, Katie. We have the two Katie’继续。这会很有趣。

Katie: It is gonna be fun. So to start off, I wanted you to define a few of the terms 那 you use often so 那 we have a framework for this interview. So you use the term “nutritious movement”相当多，你的书叫做“Move 您r DNA.” So, what do you mean by 营养运动?

凯蒂: Well, 营养运动, it is kind of a simple way of summing up a very large idea, which is, I would say maybe most listeners have this understanding of how nuanced nutrition is 那 you don’就像唐一样，只需要正确饮食’饥饿不是唯一的营养指南。所以’不仅有足够的卡路里’s 那 you’重新获得一系列的常量营养素，对吗？那你’ve got fats 和 proteins 和 carbohydrates, but 那’s not even really sufficient if you only have those guidelines, 那 there’s also vitamins 和 分erals, 和 那 there’s dosages or percentages of your total diet 那 needs to come from or contain all of these various components. And so 那 comes easy to us because we’所有收到此基准信息的方法。例如，这种营养需要500年的想法。你知道的’大约有500年的数据收集历史。但是我在小学中学到了很多，对吗？我记得学习美食金字塔，喜欢这里’s what a protein is in a very age-appropriate way. But these ideas were introduced very early on because nutrition is very impactful to the physical experience 那 you’re having.

另一方面，我们’从字面上看，在识别运动的过程中确实有点落后，这与您需要的进食方式相同，但不仅如此。它需要千差万别，并且您需要特定数量的不同类型的动作。我们只是说有点喜欢更多。我们’仍然没有意识到您移动了多少以及如何移动的深远影响，也许该移动的分布频率正在极大地影响您的身体体验’有。所以我在谈论“Move your DNA”，这种运动确实会在细胞水平上影响您喜欢的食物。因此，如果我们可以考虑一下，如果可以延长500年’值得了解输入如何工作，以及我们可以为人体提供必要的输入…可以节省一些运动时间，以帮助我们获得与全食物饮食相同但与整个食物运动饮食相同的食物。什么’是一种营养丰富的运动饮食，不仅具有运动所需的丰度（例如运动所需的总运动时间），而且还包含所有细微差异，确保我们所有部位的运动都良好。然后’这实际上是营养运动的代表。它’s like you…it’与营养相同。它’也是一样，因此您可以节省时间并保持身体健康。

Katie: Yeah. And I love 那 you’我真的是率先对此进行了研究并为此撰写了很多文章，因为我认为您’re right. We all know 那 we’现在比以往任何时候都久坐不动，但我想你’re really breaking down how 那’确实在细胞层面上影响了我们，这真是太棒了。我想谈谈您最喜欢的事情之一，至少我’我根据您的记录猜测，您最喜欢的事情之一就是蹲，因为您有一块“You 唐’t Know Squat”另一个叫“You Still 唐’t Know Squat,”并且您那里有一些很棒的信息。但基本上，您说每个人都应该蹲。孩子们做得完美。一世’我看着我的孩子学会走路，她可以完美蹲下而无需尝试。它’s the walking 那’对她来说很难。所以说说蹲以及为什么’s such a base mechanic 那 we need to relearn if we forgotten how.

凯蒂：好吧’那种之一…我认为深蹲就像是大量营养素，对吗？它’s a movement 那 human bodies have been doing really kind of up until now, right? Squats are how you go to bathroom. They’关于你如何休息。在我们特定的文化中’ve got chairs 和 we’ve got toilets. We’ve kind of phased out 那 movement, but we still have the anatomy 那 requires 那 movement to stay fully strong, fully supple, right? So kids can do it very well because 他们 haven’t adapted to not squatting yet. The environment 那 we live in is a non-squat environment so we have become non-squatters. Some may go try to do it. It’s 喜欢，“Uh, my body doesn’t do 那.”孩子们尚未适应成为非s屋者。他们像我们一样擅自占地。而只要你不 ’t interfere with 那 behavior by, 你懂，not allowing them to squat or maybe putting so much furniture out 哪里 他们 would take rest in a different way, 他们’re gonna maintain 那 ability 和 mobility in 那 part.

So squatting, 那’例如，如果您认为蹲便是一种营养，’t have 那 nutrient, there are symptoms 那 arise. I think the squatting stuff really was in response to 骨盆底问题, low back issues, hip 和 knee issues. And everyone’s 喜欢，“所有这些部分都在伤害我。一世’m very young. 什么’s the issue?” And I was 喜欢，“Well, there’s this movement 那 the human body has done really ultimately throughout its history just until right now 那 if it was done, 和 not just 1 squat or 10 but, 你懂，a lot…like this whole category of squatting varied throughout the day, peppered through your life, if you will. Had you been doing 那, then your knee mobility 和 your hip mobility 和 your low back mobility 和 your pelvic resting position 和 then also how those mobilities, when you have them, when you go to walk, when you’re not squatting, how those mobilities then change the muscles 那 you’re using when you walk 和 you stand, how do we have this, then the mechanical contributors to all of those things 那 you’re talking about, the knee pain or the back pain or the SI joint pain or the pubic symphysis pain or multitude of pelvic stuff, 喜欢，那 it wouldn’表现得如此出色。”

那么，就像营养疗法一样，对吗？如果你去找营养师，他们’re 喜欢，“Oh, I see you’我有坏血病的症状。这里’首先是一些维生素C，然后是一些含有维生素C的饮食。”然后，您逐渐开始努力填补输入的空白​​，然后在补充维生素C时，最终选择了富含维生素C的食物，并替换了可能使您无法吸收维生素C的食物，营养是很细微的差别，您开始可以缓解症状。所以蹲对我来说就是那样。你不’不知道下蹲就像“Okay. Maybe you’从来没有像我们大多数人以前蹲过，所以这里有点指导您了解您的哪些部分…”就像蹲着一样容易，就像孩子在做时一样容易。它需要机动性，很多不同部分的完全机动性，对吗？它’踝关节，脚部肌肉，小腿，腿筋，四头肌和髋屈肌的活动性，当您下蹲时，所有这些都必须改变形状。而且他们改变形状的能力越弱，通常情况下，您的背部就不得不改变形状，而您只是向后翻滚，所以人们喜欢“I can’t squat.”或者，也许您有到达那里的机动性，但随后您却没有’您的腿没有力量将自己保持在该位置，因为’s, 你懂，you’是个沉重的成年人，要降低自己的体重到地面或远离地面，需要相当多的力量，所以人们会说，“I’蹲下来，但是当我站起来时，我感到很多向下的压力，”你懂。也许那个’加剧盆腔症状或腹泻。它’s 喜欢，“是的，好的，所以现在，我们知道我们有很多部位，关节和肌肉以及结缔组织和运动习惯，只需做一件简单的事情就需要训练它们。”

因此，我们首先开始补充一些纠正措施，对吗？我们’像维生素一样重新使用它们，像在这里伸展小腿一样，我 ’我要在这里拉大腿筋。你呢’re just trying to start moving these joints or hinges 那 haven’t非常感动。然后你’再下蹲一下，但是你’我要在这里放一些东西并坚持在这里，因为我们’re gonna try to reduce the weight 那 you’重新下蹲，所以它’s bolstered a little bit so 那 it’就像是一种更温和的方法，如果您愿意的话，可以慢慢开始恢复维生素的下蹲，然后逐渐缓慢地恢复，…that’s补充版本。但是后来’s 喜欢，“好的。好吧，为什么不每天都坐在椅子上’您是蹲下还是蹲下蹲下休息？” And now, 那’s the equivalent to choosing a different movement diet, like choosing to partake of movements 那 have more nutritional benefits to you 那 are moving more of those cells in a cellular level.

And then, low 和 behold, as you do more of these mobility exercises 和 add more of these different motions into your life, the symptoms 那 you are experiencing in the absence of vitamins squat start to subside. So not all humans move exactly in the same way, but there are these fundamental categories of movements 那 all humans have likely done throughout eon or millennia. So I’m trying to help people kind of get these main categories 那 他们 might have been missing. Maybe 他们 can’不要因为脚，膝盖或背部问题而走很长距离，否则他们可以’t squat, or 他们 can’t hold their weight on their arms, trying to fill in these gaps in their movement diets so 那 the symptoms 那 他们’re experiencing, whether, like I said, like pelvic issues or low back or knee or shoulder or wrist, 那 we can see those more of symptoms of a lack of particular types of movement. So I love the squat. I love the squat because in graduate school, 那’s what I…I studied a female pelvic floor disorder. And so for me, 那 was really standing out as a huge difference between how we move, 你懂，Western 和 North Americans, compared to other people in the world 那 don’t have 那 same…谁经常下蹲我像，“哦，这真的很有帮助。” And it turns out 那 it has been for a lot of people, reintroducing the squat in a kind of gentle step-by-step format.

Katie: Yeah. I love 那. I love 那 you call it vitamin squad. And I know there are trainers…most recently, I was reading some work by a guy named Jersey in California who is, I believe, in his 60s 和 still has, 喜欢，amazing range of movement. He’s all about, 喜欢，people being able to keep their full squat as well 和 why 那’非常重要。和我’我也很好奇我从听众中得到的一个问题是，那些必须坐下来工作或者更受限的人。现在，我’我一天录制八次播客采访，所以我’m standing the entire time hooked up to the headphone. But I have, 喜欢，your half arch thing. I’我伸小腿，通常，我’ll ask the question, put it on mute, 和 like go down into as squat as well as 我可以 on a desk 和 even sometimes, 喜欢，lay on the floor, just different things to move around. But how can people, especially in an office setting, work 那 in on a daily basis.

凯蒂: Well, I wrote a whole book about 那 because I think it was kind of unfair. I wrote “Move 您r DNA,” which is 喜欢，“嘿，看看你需要做的所有动作，然后…” 您 know, I imagine 那 most people are in a sort of like 9 to 5 setting, doesn’t mean 那 you’在办公室，但是你 ’re like productive in a very static way. So I was 喜欢，“Okay. Here’s actually how you can be stationary, which means, 喜欢，I’我现在也在伸展小腿，因为我们’re talking.”所以我静止不动，但我’我不是久坐的。意思是我’我现在在站立的桌子上。一世’我伸展小腿一世’会伸胳膊和肩膀。一世’ll have some phone calls 那 I need to take later on, business calls, 和 I will save them all up, 和 I will go out 和 walk for an hour to be able to take them.

So acknowledging 那 most people have this limitation 那 他们 have to go to work, the easiest thing is to focus on moving outside of the least malleable areas of your life. So, are you moving in the time before you go to work, which can include getting up 15 分utes earlier simply to do a little bit of, 你懂，corrective exercise or to take a small walk? Do you walk to work or if you can’不要一路走到那里’re taking your kids to school, can you walk them to school? And if those two things are too challenging 和 那 the distance is so great, could you drive part way 和 then park in kind of a safe area 哪里 then you can then walk the kids the rest of the way, or you yourself walk the rest of the way into your office or 哪里ver you’re going for work? Is there a way to add more movement into your desk time? I do recommend 那 people create a dynamic workspace. So most of us have a pretty traditional office setup, right, 哪里 那’s just a chair, one chair 那 you sit the one way in over 和 over 和 over again, 和 then you’已经设置好办公桌了。

但是，如果您要做一件事，’re listening to this would just be to adjust the way 那 you’重新坐。所以即使你’re just totally, you feel totally trapped in 喜欢，not only I’m not allowed to have a standing work desk, 我可以’不能获得符合人体工程学的椅子或其他任何东西。它’s 喜欢，“Well, just sit differently in your own chair, scoot to the front. Stop leaning against the back of it. Tip your pelvis forward so 那 you’再移动一下腿筋，以不同的方式移动髋屈肌，对吧？” So you’re moving differently while you are just still sitting in 那 chair.

通常你’再打电话，你不’t have to do all of the tasks 那 you do probably in your chair. Can you stand up everytime you’在接电话吗？建议为您的办公室举行步行会议。您的办公室越不是传统，它们可能越好’我会接受很多这样的想法。但是如果你’要去开会，你可以参加会议吗？参加许多会议和会议，是唯一一个站立或坐在地板上的人，这会让您脱颖而出，而很多人却不这样做’t feel comfortable doing. So if you are in administration, right, 和 any HR department should, at this point, be well-versed in the idea 那 sitting long-term in a chair is not good for any employee, 和 那 strategies to get them out of it 那 are inexpensive 和 simple should be in full effect by now. Even simple things like if you have a meeting, putting a piece of paper on the back wall saying standing area or stretching area grants everyone in the office permission to get out of the chair without seeming like 他们’脱离现状。这些只是一些解决方案。

然后一件事就是，如果您使用的是站立式办公桌，’m using, to recognize 那 the way 那 you’re standing is important. So this idea of alignment, 喜欢，of adjusting your body parts to get more parts of you working. So, like if you’重新站在办公桌前，但是臀部一直在您面前，一直搁在您面前的桌子上，然后是的，’re standing. But you could be using more butt muscle 和 more hamstring muscle 和 more calves muscles to hold you as opposed to outsourcing all 那 stability to your desk.

因此，我绝对有一个基本的对齐检查表，当您选择更具动态性时，如何知道身体在空间中的位置。所以’s mostly 那, 和 then just, 你懂，when you do take movement breaks, how many 分utes do you step away from your work, if not with your body, certainly with your 分d in 那 you’可能是在上班时在Facebook上或类似我所说的社交媒体循环，例如您’re kind of pacing a loop on your computer. 如果你 notice 那 you’re doing 那 和 you’re already not being productive at work, use 那 time to stand up, reach your arms up overhead, or just simply go to a doorframe 和 reach up to the top of the doorframe because the shoulders get moved hardly at all throughout our entire lives but certainly throughout the day, 和 if you’re on the computer, 那 your arms do need to get overhead. Like, 那’一个大动作。你知道，你不’不需要做猴子酒吧体操运动。当然，这可能只是从伸手伸过头顶并做些伸展，开始，然后伸向侧面，在空中画出一点彩虹，现在，您’re moving more.

Katie: Yeah. I love 那. 您 make it very doable. 您 kind of give baby steps. I will say, I think 那 your work is having an impact, 和 there is a raising awareness about this. Even health conferences 那 I’ve gone to over the last few years, it was 喜欢，the first year, there was just like the Dave Aspreys 和 the Abel Jameses of the world standing in the back with the orange sunglasses while everybody else sat. And now, there’s a lot more of them. Then you even have like Ben Greenfield doing, 喜欢，squats back there 和 all these stretches. So I think the information is spreading, 和 it’s largely in part to what you do. And another thing 那 you have a controversial opinion on is Kegels. So obviously, these are usually recommended. My listeners are largely moms. So these are recommended after having a baby 和 at various times involved in pregnancy, 和 you have a great perspective on this. So, 哪里 do you stand on this?

凯蒂：好吧，我蹲在那些身上，而不是站在那些身上。一世’m just kidding. I would say 那 I don’凯格斯有问题。它’s just 那 他们 come from a very narrow perspective which is, I mean, obviously, your pelvic floor needs to be functional in 那 it’s strong enough to support the weight of your organs 和 anything else 那’会继续怀孕等腹部内容。不只是当你’re standing still but when you are moving, right? So if 那’当你走路，跑步，改变姿势时’re having pelvic issues, what you are seeing is 那 那 system isn’t strong enough to support the function of 那 system. And so, well, people will say, “好吧，我只喜欢在笑或跑步时撒尿。” And I would say, “Yes, when you’问题在于何时增加负载。” So maybe you’有足够的力量来支撑自己 ’re static, but you’不够坚强，无法支撑自己’re dynamic.

And so the Kegel, what I call, 喜欢，the great Kegel debate was just like this idea 那 we know 那 this needs to be stronger, 你懂，那 your whole pelvic, 那 your whole body needs to be stronger because the pelvis doesn’不能在真空中工作。但是如果我们’只是在谈论骨盆底，它确实需要更坚固。我们如何’ve decided to strengthen it is kind of 喜欢它’s at 那 supplement level, which is just, well, then squeeze it, squeeze it, squeeze it, squeeze it. It’s like giving it something to do. 让’s work it out. And 那’s fine except 那 what naturally elicits what you’re doing when you’re Kegeling, 那 pubic oxy gel contraction is simply moving around more. And so we could tell people to move around more. And I don’t only mean in terms of frequency but also having better joint range of motions so 那 you’在移动时重新使用更多零件。

您 use all of your parts. If I say…and so it’不仅蹲，我’ll also kind of pair squatting with, 喜欢，walking. To me, squatting 和 walking, 和 all of the corrective exercises 那 give you better joint ranges of motion when you squat 和 walk not only strengthen your pelvic floor, 他们 strengthen the lateral hips. They strengthen the glutes. They strengthen the hamstring. They strengthen the core musculature. That’我的方法。当我看到有人进来时’s 喜欢，“Oh, well, did you know 那 your movement is very low, not only in terms of how many 分utes you’重新移动，但是您身体的多少在移动，对吗？”所以当你不这样做时，你会变得非常僵硬’t move. When you do go to move, 喜欢，say, you’在锻炼或跑步时，仍然每天走三四英里’re not moving through the full range of motion of your joints, so very little of you is actually adapting to 那 about of movement.

凯格斯（Kegels）就像在做绝对的最少运动，只让您的骨盆底有些事情要做，而您仍然保持全身不动。它’就像，锻炼一条肌肉。它’s like saying 那 you want a stronger, more robust shoulder 和 only doing bicep curls. Will your shoulder get stronger if you do bicep curls? Certainly to an extent, but the whole system won’t be improved. It will only be improved in 那 one way 那 your shoulder works to help you do a bicep curl. And then when you do a ton of bicep curls, if 那’s your only action of 那 body part over time, your arm starts to kind of take on the shape of a bicep curl. It’s start to, 你懂，as you start to get a little tense in through the elbow, maybe your shoulder pulls forward, because when you work one muscle in isolation, it tends to pull the skeleton in a particular way. And 那’对于Kegels来说，这确实是我最大的问题，因为我会与…您知道，我们认为骨盆底问题就像是新妈妈问题或有多个孩子问题的妈妈一样。但是对我来说，我对骨盆底问题的看法是由许多肌肉非常紧张的健身专业人士提供的，他们非常认为自己非常适合，没有孩子。

因此，当您看到问题的全部内容时，就可以开始了，“Oh, okay, 我可以 see 那 那 repetitive tension of the pelvic floor kind of done in isolation can shape the pelvis in a way 那 perpetuates it.” So the Kegel’是很好的补品，但您可以在补品上加OD，使自己像生病一样生病’t have it. I’我不太喜欢凯格斯（Kegels），我想这就是我的方式’我经常刻画如果你没有’看不到我的很多东西’除了写几篇文章外，还写了更多的文章，介绍了更整体的身体，整个生活的物理解决方案，在这种情况下，适用于骨盆底。但是那’实际上，我对所有事物（例如肌肉骨骼）的处理方式都是如此，“Let’考虑上下文，以便我们不’不能像我们一生中那样服用一种小补品，然后不得不做一些其他补品来平衡这种多余的补品。” That just more of…that’s why a natural…我喜欢自然运动，因为它’有点类似于退后一步，不考虑补品或试图平衡您的补品’re taking, but considering the foods 那 you’重新选择饮食和饮食。然后，您知道，它从那里得到越来越清晰的上下文，这是什么使我们选择一种特殊的运动饮食，我们可以稍微玩些这些吗？我更喜欢更广阔的视野。

Katie: I love 那 because I’m the same way when it comes to food 和 a real food diet 和 how 喜欢，“Yeah. 那里’是补充食品的时间和地点，但要等到您真正的饮食开始后才可以。” And also, like you said, if you take too much of one thing, you take too much vitamin A, it interferes with vitamin D or calcium 和 magnesium 和 how all of these have to work together in the right amount. So I love 那 you bring 那 perspective to movement 哪里 I think it’s incredibly important. Another thing 那 you’ve written quite a bit about, 和 I know I have a lot of questions from listeners is about diastasis 和 especially after pregnancy. And obviously, I would guess 那 all the movement helps with 那 as well, but is 那 related to the pelvic floor movement? Are there other things women would wanna specifically be focusing on if 他们 know 他们 have 那 problem?

凯蒂：好吧’有趣的是，如果您是腹泻性直肠和骨盆底疾病， ’re interested in both of them, this pertains to both, 他们 are pressure-related ailments. They are ailments 那 are…they’re not only, 喜欢，weaknesses. Like, it’对于我们来说，很容易将所有内容煮沸或将所有内容粉刷到这一部分。’如果您的骨盆底不稳固’在出现骨盆底问题和腹直肌或核心肌肉强直的情况下，要足够强壮’直肠疾病时足够坚固。在哪里’s more 那 the way 那 you are moving, 他们’re creating, or the way 那 you’重新绷紧你的肌肉，我会全力以赴，’re creating high pressures, 和 these high pressures are straining different tissues. And so one of the things 那 really affects intra-abdominal 和 pelvic pressures have to do with the tension of your upper body.

所以我认为’一开始对人们来说很奇怪，如果他们会来找我或我们的任何一位老师或读一些我们的书，就像“您知道，在直线型腹泻中，很多起因于肩部活动。” It’在某种程度上断开连接’s 喜欢，“为什么我要为盆腔问题做肩膀？” It’s like because the tension 那 is in your shoulders 和 your neck 和 your arms is causing your upper body to curl forward, but you don’上身向前弯曲时走动。您有点像抬胸，将肋骨推出或’将骨盆向前推。这些事情开始以一种非常频繁地，不自然地频繁地拉动您腹部的组织。当在几乎完全不动的情况下进行操作时，身体的所有其他部位’s, over this time, these deformations. And, 你懂，we think of our pelvic organs as something 那 the pelvic floor is solely supporting. It’就像，但是那些在…they’重新连接韧带。他们’得到其他器官和韧带的支持。它’不仅限于骨盆底。

所以呢 happens when you are constantly bearing down on those pelvic organs 和 then 他们’重新拉紧韧带，然后慢慢拉紧，随着时间的流逝，它们会变形，从而使它们下降。如此’只是，有了直肠转移，’s this idea 那 this isn’一个弱点问题。这是一个运动问题，’s not 那 one body part isn’t strong enough. It’s 那 you hardly move, hardly any of your body, 和 these are the symptoms of movement malnutrition rather than the weakness of one particular part. I think 那’s my overall message, is 那 what we consider a musculoskeletal ailment or some sort of physical thing, there are certainly many other factors. 您 have to consider movement 和 other in parts of the environment. But a main player in your environment is the types 和 frequencies of movement 那 you’re getting.

很多事情都与运动营养不良有关，因此不必再次补充营养，而不必补充营养，例如，如果您需要做运动来纠正某些问题，但是必须无限期地进行锻炼，那么您可以’t really change enough about the scenario 那 was leading it 那 way. So I would say, “I’d rather you focus your time on changing these aspects of lifestyle or movement practice so 那 you don’不必在余生中进行运动补充，但是您可以将运动重新融入生活，因此您’re not thinking about or worrying about this one part of your body. 您’re gonna be using your body in a way for your life 那 just has 那, in 那 effect, of you no longer have a 腹直肌分离.”

凯蒂：这完全有道理。而且我知道很多人可能想知道如何将这些东西切实地整合到您的日常生活中。从我身上’ve read on your blog, you guys have a really interesting way 那 you do this on a daily basis. 您 have very limited furniture compared to most people. And this is very intentional for you. So, can we talk about your house, 和 what it looks 喜欢，and why you made those choices?

凯蒂：好吧’s just 喜欢，you know, people are trying to eat better. If 他们 say, “You know, 凯蒂, I wanna start a whole food diet,” often time…you know, “I wanna eat better. I have this health issue or this physical scenario 那 I’m trying to move away from, 和 I recognize 那 it relates to what I’m eating.” One of the practical tips for eating better is to remove all the food 那 keeps pushing you towards 那 physical issue in the first place, right? So you could bring healthy stuff in, but if you leave, 喜欢，the junk food in the house, there’s a very strong chance 那 the environment 那 you’重新创建将影响您以不同方式过渡到饮食的程度。

So for me, once I recognize 喜欢，“哦，我想整天休息。” 那里’s nothing wrong with taking rest or sitting, but I am so conditioned to, like my human nature is conditioned to the path of least resistance, like the most energy consuming habit, 那 I will always plop in a chair versus sitting on the floor in front of it. Once I recognize 那, oh, like I…that my chairs in the house are kind of like the equivalent to junk food, 他们’re fast, 他们’re easy, but 他们’re not as 有营养的 as if I just carried my weight 和 did the squat all the way down to the floor 和 then sat with my legs in a particular way 那 is basically like a separate stretch exercise, but it’s not, it’只是我必须坐在地板上的方式，然后我意识到我可以利用我的环境来促进更好的结果，而无需考虑它。

So 那 was…it was just me…our main approach to health these days seems to be trying to bring new behaviors into the existing environment, which requires a tremendous amount of will power, which is, in itself, not really a natural human thing 那 we have to deal with, right? Like, we never had abundance 和 the ability to choose between so many behaviors. 那里 was just the 分imal things 那 you had 和 you were, 喜欢，lucky to have them. 您 didn’t have to choose between a food 那 was better or worse from you. It was 喜欢，“Well, this is the only food 那’s around,” so you’再感激地吃掉它。

So I just recognized 那 代替 of constantly choosing to prioritize or to add into my life hip stretches 和 knee stretches 和 , 你懂，20 squats a day 和 then plop down on the couch afterwards, 那 I could just remove my couch 和 then I would get naturally throughout my day, not having to schedule separate exercise time. 所有 of the corrective exercises 那 I was doing, 和 I didn’不必再考虑了，我没有’t have to schedule it separately in my life. So 那’s 为什么我们 got rid of the furniture, was really to facilitate the behavior 那 we were after.

凯蒂：我明白了。我敢打赌…因为你有两个孩子，对吗？

凯蒂: Yeah.

Katie: I bet 那 was easier adjustment for them or maybe it was before 他们 were born. But I’m assuming 他们 probably loved 那. Or, my kids do 喜欢，there are times a week, 喜欢，have a picnic on the floor, like just sit on the floor. They love it.

凯蒂：是的，我’ve got two kids 和 the bulk of this was all done before 他们 were born, although we’re constantly tweaking our environment in different ways 那 facilitates more movement. Because 他们 haven’t lost their ability for floor-sitting with ease, like 他们 haven’t adapted to chairs, so therefore squatting 和 sitting on the floor, 他们 maintained all of their mobility to do so. 所以’s not only like I’ll have parents, 他们’ll 喜欢，“My kids don’t wanna do 那. They like the couch.” Well, 喜欢，sure, 他们’重新适应它。对于很多人来说，坐在地板上不舒服。他们’re not used to the joint ranges of motion or the strengths used to come up 和 down or the pressure or 那…like it’s the actual deformation of your flesh when you sit on something firm versus something 那’里面充满了棉花。就像，当您坐在沙发上时，沙发会变形。你的身体不’不能变形。如果你’re on the ground, the tissue has to do 那 deformation, which is also part of movement.

因此，他们喜欢它，因为他们为此花费了更多的身体。但是我不’甚至不知道他们是否特别了解差异，因为他们没有’t过渡。我想，当我们’在很多地方，我们当然旅行很多，而我们’re in…你知道，大多数地方都是’t chair-free or furniture-free. So I think 他们 feel more 那 their movement is encroached once 他们’我有自由行动的能力。然后，您知道，我们有一间小房子，所以我们的房子里有很多空间，没有那些坐着的东西。因此，他们肯定会感觉到运动能力的下降，这有点类似于是否有人比传统的鞋开始穿着极少的鞋，或者在夏天结束时’re used to putting on a sandal 和 how free your feet feel, 你懂，to move around 和 be in the air, 和 then all of a sudden, you go into like a sock 和 a winter shoe 和 you can feel the size of it, like you can feel 那 pressure on your body, like a tight shoe, only because you’ve experienced the sandal. So because my kids have kind of the barefoot equivalent to home-living when we go into other places, I think 他们 can feel. 我可以 certainly feel like my body is being pushed or held together by how much stuff is in a house preventing you from moving fully through it.

Katie: Yeah. That makes so much sense, 和 I love, I saw something recent about how 他们 had figured out this correlation, like if you can stand up from sitting position without using your hands or grabbing onto something or holding your knees, 他们’re 喜欢它 was actually correlated with longer life. And I was laughing because I’m 喜欢，“Katy’这么多年来一直在说’与运动有关，但这很有道理。” And as far as like kids 和 integrating daily movement, I got so many questions about this, people asking, what about schools? Do your kids go to school or homeschool, 和 how do you recommend 那 parents can incorporate this when kids have to be sitting because it’s so hard for them to have to sit still all day? Are there any things 那 parents can do to help incorporate movement even when their kids are in school?

凯蒂: Yeah. And it’s the same advice for an office. Like, I feel like in a 9 to 5 reality, which I would put 那 on both work 和 also education, 那’s a reality for a lot of people, 和 so to approach it in exactly the same ways. Like, step one, you look at your time before 和 after 那 kind of least mobile period. Like, the most rigid part of your day is the part 那 you have to clock in 和 clock out. Like, you can’t just come into school an hour late because you felt 喜欢它. Like, you’预计会开始计时’从实用的角度讲，它的延展性不是很好。那么，您的家人早上在做些什么运动？如果你’re 喜欢，“There’s no way 我可以 get more movement. It’s so hectic.” It’s 喜欢，“好的。好吧，那为什么这么忙呢？” And, 喜欢，let’看我们是否可以通过增加运动来使其变得不那么忙碌。

So a lot of things 那 we do are sunrise breakfast, 你懂，packing up breakfast, 和 we do this for dinner, too. We often, I think, limit our exercise or hike to being like not during dinner time or meal time. But for me, I will oftentimes whip up something for dinner before I go to bed. 您 know, 喜欢，maybe I’ll make a frittata or some things 那’s already cooked in the morning. I just slice it 和 I put it in a box, 和 we go for an hour walk or bike ride. Then 那 just replaces breakfast time. And I find 那, 喜欢，my kids are always like up 和 excited to get out 和 那 他们’re often kind of squelched 那 I have…like, “我要带午餐或做所有这些事情。” So once I kind of shifted 哪里 I was doing my work, I found 那 there was this time in the morning 哪里…you know, you have to go to bed earlier to be able to get up earlier, so switching maybe your sleeping practices a little bit. It gave us like an hour of movement before our day even started, 和 we just eat breakfast on the go, so little things like 那. Dinner hikes are a big thing for us.

您 know, oftentimes, work days are long 和 , 喜欢，you’re just kinda stumbling out at 5:00. 您’re 喜欢，“I can’相信我整天都在电脑前。”然后在你的脑海里’re 喜欢，“Well, now it’s dinnertime,” 和 then it’洗澡了，然后’s bedtime. We have 那 very rigid thinking. It’s like we’重新固定在我们的身体中，我们’在我们的日程安排中有点不动和不灵活。就像，我们真的感觉在那里’s certain foods 那 you can eat at breakfast time 和 certain foods you can eat a dinner time in a certain way 那 the dinner hour has to happen because we’re so locked to 那. It makes changing the way we behave a little bit different.

So once you realize you can eat whatever you want, whenever you want, 那 makes a little bit more flexible. And it’可以去远足。就像，我们’ll often, again, pack up food 和 then just set out for three miles 和 walk all the way through right up until bedtime, 和 那 becomes the favorite part of the day. And it just all of us are there. And people feel, sometimes feel tired, maybe feel 喜欢，“哦，孩子们好累。” 您 get revived really from movement. 您 know, you don’t have to go fast. 您 just go out there kind of slowly hiking along 和 everyone’满足他们在运动和饮食方面的营养需求。

So looking at 那 non-school time is probably the easiest way because you have very little…I mean, you have plenty of input about how school happens. 您 can certainly be very vocal 和 asking about a transition to, 你懂，bringing back playtimes, 和 can teachers add more movement? I mean, these, eventually, are going to be the steps, I think, 那 parents are gonna have to take, is to say, “我们需要将运动重新带回学校，就像父母可以（通常）知道提供什么食物一样…” But, 你懂，那’s very uphill working. 您 wanna, before you start on the uphill, you wanna make sure 那 you’在您轻松拥有更大影响力的所有时间重新最大化运动。

凯蒂：那’很好的建议。我想你’说到大人，你不’t have to sit in your chair the same way 和 you can move 那 way. I feel like kids do 那 naturally. Like, I don’我不知道任何一整天都静静坐着的孩子。他们’re, 喜欢，sitting on one foot. They’re sitting in the front of their chair, the back of their chair, like across, like 他们 move so much more even just in a chair than we do.

凯蒂：他们’re fidgeting, 和 to maybe not frame fidgeting or the inability to sit still as a bad thing. I mean, it certainly, I think, makes it challenging for the teacher who needs everyone to be still but 那 there’s nothing wrong with 那 child, 你懂，to keep 那 in your 分d as a parent. And 你懂，and you can say, “I know 那 when you’re in school 那 you’re fidgety. I just wanna let you know 那 I know 那 this is something natural 那 your body is needing to do to balance the movement. And it’s okay with me 那 you’重新做，只是不静噪。” I think a lot of our movement faculties have been squelched by others inputting 那 our movement is wrong for us to do, not being able to separate, as an adult, what’s necessary for a particular institution to survive being something separate than what one component in 那 institution, which would be the child, what 那 needs to survive, so just to keep those separate in your 分d.

甚至可以，如果您’再说一个老师“I need everyone to be still so 那 everyone can hear me. 您 know, 喜欢，I appreciate the movement. I love 那 you’重新移动身体。那’s great. Could everyone freeze for just a second so 我可以 say this 和 not have to talk about the noise 那 your body is making, 你懂，那 we can keep making a distinction between manners 和 biology,” or something 那 the school needs to be able to run on 那 even you can still ask for what you need as an administrator but to not tie it to being good or bad or right or wrong because I’我有很多成年人谈论你刚才所说的话，“You’re telling me now 那 I should be fidgeting in my chair, 和 I used to do 那 和 every adult told me 那 I was bad.” And so now, 他们’re almost…whether 他们 know it or not, 那 messaging 那 for them to move is bad 和 rude 和 wrong, like 他们’克服挑战。

Katie: Yeah. I think 那’s a great point. And another thing 那 I saw a lot of people say when I asked people, 喜欢，“在这次面试中我应该问你什么” a lot of people said things 喜欢，“Well, my kids already get plenty of movement because 他们’从事体育运动，但我需要努力。” And I know you have an interesting perspective on organized sports 和 actually, I 100% agree with you, but can you talk about, 喜欢，why sports, just in 和 of themselves, don’t necessarily meet all the movement criteria 那 a person needs?

凯蒂: Well, 和 plenty of movement is, 你懂，like what does 那 mean? Plenty of movement usually means 那 people are getting like what we perceive we need, which is like 那 one hour of exercise or, 你懂，90 分utes, which is a very low total amount of movement. Like, if you move an hour a day, 那’一天的4％。那么你’re still sedentary. Like, even exercisers who exercise every day are still, by definition, academic definition in exercise science, sedentary. So we need to adjust our 分dset about when someone has plenty of movement or not or like 那 this message doesn’这与他们有关，因为它确实与生活在久坐的文化或运动外包文化中的任何人有关，这就是我们。

综上所述，体育可以是获得某种运动，学习某些技能，进行一些团队合作以及学习获胜和失败以及对某件事的承诺的好方法。那里’s a lot of skills 那 come from it. However, sports, when we do sports, we tend to be doing one single sport, like you’在做体操还是你’在做棒球还是你’在踢足球还是你’re playing football. Sports are the equivalent to eating one particular food over 和 over 和 over again. So while 那 food could be deemed a 有营养的 food in 那 within it are many nutrients, no single food makes up a healthy diet. 如果你 were just 喜欢，“What’最健康的食物？ ”像羽衣甘蓝，我们总是像…right now, it’s like the ultimate healthy food, or you can even think of, 喜欢，bone broth, like a cup of bone broth to be very nutrient-dense. But you cannot subsist on it alone, meaning 那 you are going to…你可能营养不良。如果您一次又一次地反复食用一种食物，则会营养不良，因为您不’需要足够的食物。您需要制作完整的营养素。

And so sports, again, 他们 are usually about of movement happening in an otherwise sedentary context. That goes for exercisers, too. This whole thing goes for exercisers. Sports is the same thing. To the mode, which is, again, it’s 那 academic or clinical term for whatever it is 那 you’re consuming over 和 over again. 您r mode of movement or exercise or sports, when it’s the same, it’s just repetitious over 和 over again. And when you physically adapt to the same thing, what happen is some of your tissues get very, very dense 和 strong 和 all of the others 那 aren’t used for those particular movements get relatively weaker, 和 then 那’弱者与强者之间的接口在哪里’s injuries.

所以，我的意思是，就儿童的运动和伤害而言，’因为他们没有’t really used to play organized sports in the way 那 他们 do now. And I think 那 organized sport is kind of…it’s been ramped up, so to speak, in this kind of society 那 doesn’t move very much. We’re 喜欢，“我们的孩子需要搬家。好的我’m gonna put him in this class, right, 和 他们’re gonna do this sport 那’s gonna be intense.” So you take sedentary kids, you put them into something 那’s repetitive 和 intense, 和 他们 start doing it younger 和 younger. I mean, we played…I’m 42.我们放学后整天都在玩。我们没有’不要玩任何特定的运动。当我们做运动时，我们仍然骑着自行车去运动并回到家中，并且在有很长的休息时间之前和之后，我们仍然玩游戏和玩游戏。所以呢’久坐不动，我们当时’t as specialized, meaning, there was great variance to the types of movements 那 we did.

所以现在，你’ve got…there seems to be this transition of thinking. Most professional athletes 和 really, really good athletes did not specialize as children. They played three or four sports all seasons 和 then 他们 just happen to, by the time 他们 were, 喜欢，18 or 19, be really good at one of them, but it was done in a context of lots of other strengths 和 movements 和 then 他们 went on from there. Now, we’ve got this idea 那, well, if 他们 like this, 和 we start them early, 他们’re gonna be really good by the time 那 他们’re, 你懂，ready to go off 和 to play college sports or play professional sports, but the opposite effect is actually happening. 什么’s happening is 他们 don’t have a very diverse base of movement strengths, 和 他们 tend to get injured very early or are so burnt out on doing it for the repetition 那 他们 don’t really go forward. So 那’运动科学中的新事物，“哦，早期的专业化确实会使您变得更弱，而不是更强。”

所以我认为运动很棒。我的孩子踢足球，以防万一有人’s wondering. Although we have sawed off the back of their soccer cleats, so 他们’re not wearing heeled soccer shoes, which most of them are, but 他们 play soccer, but 他们 will have, 你懂，walked three or four miles every day 那 他们 play soccer. Like, I wouldn’t cross off the box of movement just because 他们 played a sport, just because 他们 practiced for a couple of hours 和 played a game on Saturday. I would still consider them sedentary because their total daily movement was so low.

Katie: Yeah, such an important point, 和 at least from the few professional athletes 那 I’我一生都在和我聊天’重新获得100％的权利。他们没有’t start off playing it for their one sport. They played a lot of sports. They just loved being active. And also, the thing 那 like 那 entire generation, 他们 were playing outside. They were climbing trees. They were building sport. They were swimming. They were doing all these, 喜欢，really dynamic movements. And I know you’ve written about, 喜欢，the importance of climbing 和 hanging 和 all these things 那 kids aren’t doing very much anymore. So I think 那’s a great point, like sports have a place, but 他们’不是唯一的事情。和我’ve got a few other kind of rapid fire of questions from people 那, 喜欢，他们 really wanted answers from you. 您 don’不必快速回答，但是我想确保让他们参与进来。所以之一是，怀孕或怀孕后是否还有其他或不同的运动要求？

凯蒂: I don’t really think so. No. Like, 你懂，a lot of what I do is based on, 喜欢，an evolutionary biology, modern hunter-gatherer approach. So there’s not radical transitions in, 喜欢，the needs, like the movement needs. In fact, I would say 那 someone who is pregnant would benefit, 喜欢，relatively more from moving around than someone not pregnant for many reasons. Like, we could do a whole entire show on just the pregnant body 和 its movement needs. But, no, I wouldn’t say 那…I think we’如此习惯于构图。当我’m saying this, I go, I probably said 180 degrees for most people, which is like here are the concerns 那 you need when you’re…想想你什么时候’re moving when you’re pregnant.

但是那些通常来自久坐/锻炼的心态，对我来说，’s more the understanding 那 your whole body needs to be moving a whole lot through your whole life, 那 pregnancy is probably the best time, or even before you’re pregnant, 喜欢，to start 那 分dset so 那 you can most fluidly utilize 那 mass coming on to become very strong for the sport 那 you’re about to, 你懂，那 you’re training for a sport essentially, if you wanna think about giving birth as a maybe your most athletic endeavor ever, which for many people it is, 那 you have this long training period for it 和 那 那’s really a great time to start transitioning into what I would call a more movement-rich life versus start this exercise program now 那 you would be transitioning your body to be 和 your life to have a lot more movement in it for a really great outcome, 你懂，as you’re…不仅有孩子，而且，就像你’re going into parenthood. 您 now have an 8-pound accessory, 6 to 10-pound accessory 那 you are going to be having on you. And a lot of women will write me, it’s 喜欢，“当我抱着婴儿时’s like I get pubic symphysis. 我可以’保持很长时间。当我给宝宝穿衣服时，我的腹泻会加重，”你知道，就像他们 ’重新尝试平衡所有这些东西。

所以’是种开始思考更多运动的好时机，而且’也许是最简单的时间，因为我觉得…I’m just even speaking from experience. Once I knew I was pregnant, it seemed like health behaviors seemed 那 more important to me because it wasn’t me really 那 I was thinking of 那 are benefiting from. It was this child. And so I think your motivation is higher, your adherence is higher, your interest, it’s like very intrinsic, 等等’现在是开始过渡到这种思维方式的绝佳时机。然后，当您的孩子出来时，现在，您的孩子可以在第一天立即开始从您的运动丰富的生活中受益，因为您’永远不要只在与孩子在一起时才移动自己，’re moving them as well, 和 so 那 ends off paying off many times over as you go forward.

Katie: Yeah. I think 那’s an awesome point. Another question 那 I’人们从中得到了很多关于极简鞋的信息。它’s a more popular thing now. People are raising awareness about the importance of not having a high heel on your shoe but even just having a 分imal drop on your heel in general. And a lot of people said 喜欢，“她推荐什么具体的鞋子？您怎么知道您是否找到了好鞋子，尤其是给孩子，婴儿和学步童穿的鞋子，您会怎么做？”

凯蒂：好吧，我在我的网站上维护了鞋子清单。因此，您总是可以去那里看看冬鞋，夏鞋，然后再看普通的鞋子清单。那里 ’现在也是孩子列表。然后在孩子名单上，就像’s so many brands. 您 can just look 和 see. Rather than having a specific brand, there are general features, 和 the shopping features are also on those blog posts so 那 you can just print them off 和 be 喜欢，“Okay. Here’s what I’m looking for.” So you’重新寻找一条最小的脚跟，好吧，尽可能地低找到它。而且经常，就像我的一些书一样，我会展示，“And here’我们如何在家里用Skilsaw去除脚跟，” when you can’找不到您真正需要的东西。所以那里’s 分imal heel. 那里 is the ability for the toes to spread in the front of the shoe. So 那 front of the shoe is called a toe box, so a wide toe box, something 那 doesn’t将脚趾按在一起或防止其移动。那里’鞋子的前部也可以抬起脚，很多鞋子有点像宫廷小丑的鞋子，只是不太明显，它们会向上弯曲。那里’如果是您在网站上的图片’re not sure what 那 toe lift looks like.

Flexible sole, so if you go grab your kids shoes 和 you bend them in half 和 then twist them along their long axis, are 他们 very malleable? If not, you’不会让您的脚动得太多。所以我不’不知道是否有很多人知道，但是体内25％的肌肉和骨骼来自脚踝。那里’s 33 joints in each foot. When you put something on it 那 doesn’t bend or move, 那 means 那 you’我已经固定住了“cast”在我很多书中，你’ve 投ed those joints 和 all of the muscles between those joints. So your footwear is, in fact, limiting lots of motion of your body, not only the heel. The heel is the part of a shoe 那 kind of 投s many parts outside of the foot. It’s 投ing your calves, your knees, your hips, your pelvis, your low back, your neck. 如果你 could only, 喜欢，do one feature of a shoe, I think I’d如果您建议将脚跟放下’re feeling overwhelmed by the list of five. So 那 was flexible sole.

而鞋帮，鞋帮是最后一个，鞋帮是将鞋子连接到脚上的那部分鞋子。因此，触发器的上端很小，对吗？所以’不仅小，而且’将双脚连接到鞋子。每当您迈出一步时，您的脚就会从鞋底移开。所以它没有什么’称为全鞋面。但是，您可以穿凉鞋，也可以在拖鞋上放一条后绑带，几乎不增加鞋子的重量，然后鞋子就会抬起脚。所以当鞋子没有 ’不能完全依附在脚上’例如触发器或类似滑入式木log或m子，您最终会用脚趾抓住它。所以如果你’重新穿上这样的衣服，走几步，注意脚趾如何缩短和抓地力。当您穿上鞋子时，您实际上会改变自己的步伐和步伐，如果不穿，就会踢脚’不要做其他事情。因此，我建议穿完整的鞋面，尤其是对于儿童。当我看到人字拖鞋的孩子时，我只是想去像一条小背带，然后将其放在他们的鞋背上’影响他们的步伐。他们的步伐，就像您适应椅子一样，当您坐得太多时，’通过选择鞋类，人为地改变一切以保持鞋子的状态，您将适应自己的步幅，然后适应所有受步幅影响的肌肉。以便’是您的基本购物指南。同样，您可以在这些鞋子列表上的漂亮网格中找到一个列表。

凯蒂：太棒了。一世’ll make sure we link to 那 in the show notes or I’m sure 他们 can through it. Another question related to 那, somewhat parents asking, “What about children who have flat feet or even adults who have flat feet, is there anything 那 can help with 那. I would guess 他们’d至少在一开始穿平底鞋时会更不舒服。” Do you do have an answer for 那?

凯蒂：是的。我的意思是，您拥有我所说的平足。但是平足，所以这在一本书中“Whole Body Barefoot.” 您 can learn what a flat foot is. It is simply a hip 那 is internally rotated 和 an ankle 那 dropped all the way in, so it’过度内旋。所以’更像是脚的无力，例如脚的形状’高弓或低弓由身体的肌肉和力量组成。因此，如果您的脚扁平，我的第一个建议不是鞋子。它’s to start training the muscles of the hips 和 the feet to bring your arch back, 那 you can bring your arch back. Many people have, 和 it’只是关于学习，“好吧，我的脚或足弓的形状在我的臀部受到控制，”对？如此反复，那里’s a…I think there’有几个YouTube视频’我在示范我’m talking about, so you can actually see a foot go from flat to a high arch simply by a rotation up in the hip joint. So there are exercises to do to start correcting 那. And then a lot of them also go back though to how much are you sitting? 什么 shoes are you wearing? So I don’认为我不会改变平底鞋的建议。我建议您进行更多的运动，并在脚和臀部的各个部位进行更多的运动。

Katie: Very cool. And another question 那 came up a whole lot was, “是否有针对脚底筋膜炎的以运动为基础的补救措施？’s dealing with 那 start focusing on?

凯蒂：是的，是一样的，对吗？因此，我们很多人的臀部都很虚弱，臀肌也很虚弱，小腿很紧。我们每天坐8到10个小时。我们’务必穿坚硬而后跟的鞋子。那么你’ve got…这些都是足底筋膜炎，扁平足，这些都是运动饮食的症状，就像您身体的这些部位的运动营养不良一样，这就是症状。所以’真的是一样的东西，就像均衡，饮食的均衡变化一样。那里’并不是每个人的完美饮食，但主要营养成分包括微量营养素和微量营养素，因此’脚痛的简单步骤，这是另一本书，我建议您开始学习，“哦，如果骨盆在脚上，那可以立即改变足底筋膜炎的负担，因为大腿相对于骨盆和脚旋转，’会改变负载。并且可以单独抬起所有脚趾吗？您能只抬起大脚趾吗？” That’对于任何举重的人来说，您的第一个运动就是脱鞋。您可以张开脚趾，让他们彼此不碰吗？当你’在那儿，您可以只举起大脚趾，然后可以举起第二个脚趾，然后举起第三个脚趾，第四个脚趾和第五个脚趾，然后放回原位吗？现在轮到你’重新开始训练脚部的肌肉，而不仅仅是踩在脚底筋膜上，’首当其冲。脚应该是这些非常结实而柔软的肌肉。但是您必须开始朝着他们努力。

凯蒂：太棒了。而且我知道您对此有发表。一世’ll make sure to include links to the ones 那 we’ve在演出笔记中谈到了。但是几乎只听谁’s not in the show notes, 哪里 can people find you online 和 how can 他们 find out more about the things we talked about?

凯蒂：nutritiousmovement.com是我的主要网站，然后从那里可以找到…社交媒体真的很好，如果你’re like Instagram, I post a ton of examples of how we get more movement in our life 和 exercises on 那 social media. I’在那儿最活跃。一世’我的网站底部有几类信息。所以如果你’re listening you’re like…因为我的网站是我写了近十年的博客。我的意思是，有数百篇文章。如果您想或者不想让自己不知所措，您可以坐下来阅读全文。如果您走到最底部，那里’的怀孕和婴儿。那里’s feet, there’s lifestyle, there’s, 你懂，minimal home, 和 so you can click on these categories, 和 then I have selected for you like here are the top three podcasts of 分e 那 I think will be helpful, here’s the top three 您Tube videos 那 I think will be helpful, 和 here’s 10 blog posts 那 I think will get you enough up to speed really 喜欢，“好的。现在，我觉得自己对自己在哪里有感觉’m going.”

Katie: Wonderful, 和 all those, of course, will be in the show notes as well. 您 have such amazing information. I definitely encourage everyone listening to go check it out 和 to use your programs. They’re wonderful. I’我在怀孕期间用过它，尤其是在…非常感谢您抽出宝贵的时间来这里并分享您的智慧。

凯蒂: Thank you, Katie. I appreciate it.

凯蒂：感谢大家的聆听，我’下次在“起点生活”播客中见。
如果你’重新享受这些采访，您能请两分钟在iTunes上给我留下评分或评论吗？这样做可以帮助更多的人找到播客，这意味着更多的母亲和家庭可以从该信息中受益。非常感谢您的宝贵时间，并一如既往地感谢您的收听。